Author Topic: "The Failure of Democracy"  (Read 516 times)

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BlueCross

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"The Failure of Democracy"
« on: November 09, 2016, 06:54:52 PM »
That would be the title of the next book I'm not going to write, adding to the pile of other books I haven't written.

There have been a lot of conciliatory speeches and nice 'we must move forward' comments, etc.

I am not on board.

The fucking Republicans created the illusion of a bad economy and poorly run government caused by the Obama administration.  They did everything they could to stall, defeat, and undo any legislation in order to create the non-illusion of dysfunctional government, and they did it starting six or seven years with vicious attacks on Obama, all orchestrated by a cabal of high level Republicans dedicated to disparaging the system and Obama.  Never mind if they brought themselves down as well; they were already down, but they found a way to take everyone down with them, creating a huge dissatisfaction and anger against the US government.

"It takes two to tango,"  some might say, trying to deflect some of the blame to the Democrats.  But "it only takes one to stop the dance", and the Republicans left the dance floor years ago.

That's the anger part.

The sad part is that so many bought into the Trump rhetoric, and I'm going to get personal now.  The largest demographic he won was the white non-educated males.  So yes, I'm saying he won the election due to the ignorance and stupidity of Americans.

He's a sleaze, and I really doubt he will be able to hide that personality attribute for long.  Whether it leads to just embarrassment for the US or to horrible economic situations or to dangerous international political conflicts, I don't know.   But I have little hope for anything good in the next four years.

And for all you Trump supporters out there, I will leave you with this:
"for whatever one sows, that will he also reap."
"for the record, I'm not some kind of psychotic provincialist." - Than (ed: Cit. required)
"I lost my game of NT: Garry's fault. Global warming: Garry's fault. End-of-the-Universe: Garry's fault. See it always fits. Anyway, what is Garry up to? No good I bet." - Laszlo
"As for your French, it's probably better than the average English-speaking Frenchman's Finnish! (Or something.)" - wa
"I'm back at Thunderfalls now and every minute thinking of poking a bandit in the eye with a fishhook." - Preyveil
"and yet still nothing has made it to BC's signature!"-KMD

The Hanged Man

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Re: "The Failure of Democracy"
« Reply #1 on: November 10, 2016, 01:47:07 AM »
I think people were fully aware that he was a sleaze but they voted for him anyway...

The day before Brexit, I spoke to a guy who voted for it and pointed out all of the bad things that could happen. All he said to everything I said was 'it won't.'

The sad part was that he was wrong...

They happened...

I woke up this morning, my Mum told me what had happened and I had to grab my phone to check twice... I scowered the entire net for one quote...

"Deep into that darkness peering, long I stood there wondering, fearing."
The sun beyond the mountain glows
The yellow river seaward flows
You can enjoy a grander sight
By climbing to a greater height

I have run out of places to climb. I will abandon this body and take to the air. We will leave twin vapor trails in the air, white lines etched into these rocks. I am the aerial. In my passing, I will send news to each and every star.

Mrs Brown says: 'Hapiness is an effect, not a goal.'


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Charlie is yelling @barit0wned
PC: A spider laid eggs inside my body and I need to get them out before they hatch
DM: You'll need the spider's permission first
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BlueCross

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Re: "The Failure of Democracy"
« Reply #2 on: November 10, 2016, 02:17:15 AM »
Great quote.

Let's make this thread "Quotes that define how I feel about the US election."

"for the record, I'm not some kind of psychotic provincialist." - Than (ed: Cit. required)
"I lost my game of NT: Garry's fault. Global warming: Garry's fault. End-of-the-Universe: Garry's fault. See it always fits. Anyway, what is Garry up to? No good I bet." - Laszlo
"As for your French, it's probably better than the average English-speaking Frenchman's Finnish! (Or something.)" - wa
"I'm back at Thunderfalls now and every minute thinking of poking a bandit in the eye with a fishhook." - Preyveil
"and yet still nothing has made it to BC's signature!"-KMD

KMD

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Re: "The Failure of Democracy"
« Reply #3 on: November 10, 2016, 03:22:49 AM »
I just wanted to pop in to make a couple of comments given this historic event.

Firstly BC, practicing intellectual superiority over your fellow countryman is a destructive way of thinking. First Brexit, and now a US President with no political experience. I consider these incredible historical events of democracy, make no mistake. While I'm confident that you have done thorough research, and are probably much more well-read than many Trump supporters, that does not give you the authority to be forcibly right unto others. I firmly believe that good and evil are fallacies. I do not believe that facts determine who is right or wrong. This may sound absurd, but I think humans are complex creatures driven by emotions motivations that do not need to be based on facts, and thats okay. I think thats okay.

Its my opinion that Trump (very narrowly) won this election by appealing to those "left behind"  Americans in the middle of the country, who are often ignored, and have common sense not to accept all facts as absolute truth, regardless of their demographics. For years, population centers along the coasts have defined America by groupthink, and I think what happened last night was the start of a shift in thinking. I think most Trump supporters didn't care about being politically correct, and didn't care about the lies, racism, and sexism of him because they saw his messages in their daily lives even if they could not be defended by facts. I'm not defending Trump, certainly there are many things I dislike about him, but these were people with little choice willing to fight for a cause for what they believed in, and I respect that.

I voted for Trump. Not necessarily because I like him, but because Clinton was incredibly corrupt and inauthentic. I think that a lot of people could see that. I consider a corrupt politician to be one of the most un-American things, and was proud of the results last night because of that. Earlier you posted about agreeing with Comey that she was not a criminal; Make no mistake, I think many people believed yesterday that she absolutely broke the law and got no repercussions because of her political position, and justice was now in their hands.

Despite the incredibly leftist views of nearly every major media outlet against Trump, despite their biased (and wrong-basically all of them) polls, despite Sanders' unfair treatment by the DNC, despite Clintons corruption and political connections, and despite liberals on social media who group every Trump supporter as worthless, deplorable, unintelligent, racist and sexist, a message of the people shined through last night. It is a message many do not agree with. But ignoring it will only fail us all. So please; Understand that these people have their own motivations, desires and faiths. Most only want freedom and do not actually want other people to suffer. The incredible hatred of Trump supporters, without understanding, is something that has deeply scared me over the past year or so.

I have faith in Trump, in my countrymen, and even in a higher power to bring us together to truly make America great again.

(Also I support the Brits ability to consciously and fairly vote on Brexit. I do not live there, so it is not right to force my opinion on them, even if it may affect me. Do not believe in fear, Hanged Man, believe in opportunity.)
In the wasteland, the sly survive and the past and present are one, the sinners rot and the future is the ultimate purgatory

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BlueCross

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Re: "The Failure of Democracy"
« Reply #4 on: November 10, 2016, 04:42:45 AM »
A large part of the Trump vote was anti-Hillary (as opposed to pro-Trump or anti-government).

Yet... Hillary corrupt and inauthentic?  I will readily admit she has a 'presentation' problem yet even a modest amount of digging into her supposedly misconduct reveals very little substance.

The whole email thing may have been unwise (or more likely ill-advised) but the actual damage done was negligible (or zero), andt investigations concluded there was nothing criminally chargeable (I think I've posted on this before).  And yet the Republicans have got months of mileage out this, and swallowed happily by many of the Kool-Aid drinkers.   And Trump insists (and many believe) that not only was she guilty of crimes, she should be jailed!  wtf?  Really?  I seriously have a lot of disrespect for people who just swallow this shit with their blinders on.

The Clinton Foundation is basically beyond reproach UNLESS you read the spin of right wing bloggers and politicians.   Independent reviews of charities always place them high (and some at the top) in terms of money percent spent on 'final' product, and transparency.

The Benghazi issue has been debunked over and over.

And yet when the FBI director announced (and ONLY announced) some previously 'undiscovered' emails were going to be looked into, the Republican/anti-Hillary frenzy was insane.  This reaction was from an announcement, for christ's sake of emails she was only marginally involved with. 

So please... list some of her transgressions with supporting articles (and not from Rush Limbaugh and his ilk).

I have another sidebar (mentioned once before, I believe) on the Republican anti-Obama rhetoric which went into full steam after the Affordable Care Act was passed.  That's when they adopted their scorched earth policy to insure that the seed of dishonest, inept, and corrupt government was planted firmly, and 'of course', it was all Obama's fault.  It then become a relatively easy step to link all that with Clinton.

The economy is better now than it was 7 years ago, the unemployment rate is lower, and business indicators are positive and climbing upward.  Yet a huge portion of the American public (yes, here I go again with that white uneducated demographic again) believe the country is in a shit-hole.

I have seriously avoided politics most of my life, but this episode is so beyond the pale that I am unable to stay silent.  And even if Trump manages somehow to dump Obamacare, pack the Supreme court, unregulate a ton of business guidelines, I believe we can get past most of those without severe damage.  What I am truly worried about is that if he trashes all the climate control agreements that we have just recently signed on to, he may actually hugely contribute to a pollution trend that will affect life in s seriously adverse way.  We are on a knife's edge right now of creating an irreversible and harmful climate effect.

None of the above politics matters a crap if we live in a world unable to sustain life as we currently know it.

Shit... I am really depressed now.

"for the record, I'm not some kind of psychotic provincialist." - Than (ed: Cit. required)
"I lost my game of NT: Garry's fault. Global warming: Garry's fault. End-of-the-Universe: Garry's fault. See it always fits. Anyway, what is Garry up to? No good I bet." - Laszlo
"As for your French, it's probably better than the average English-speaking Frenchman's Finnish! (Or something.)" - wa
"I'm back at Thunderfalls now and every minute thinking of poking a bandit in the eye with a fishhook." - Preyveil
"and yet still nothing has made it to BC's signature!"-KMD

Hoopy Frood

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Re: "The Failure of Democracy"
« Reply #5 on: November 10, 2016, 05:57:13 AM »
Trump (very narrowly) won this election

Although, he lost the popular vote total by over 200,000 votes.

Then again, during Barack's first term when they had a Democratic majority in both houses of congress for the first two years, after being in this situation once before where the Democrat won the popular vote but lost the electoral college due to the overall distribution of the electoral college skewing slightly Republican (Gore lost to GWB in 2000), they didn't try to push for an end to both it and Gerrymandering. But that seemed par for the course since they didn't seem to accomplish much of Obama's agenda either. The Democratic party has been spineless for a while now. Maybe this will help them grow a proverbial pair.
All right, I’ve been thinking, when life gives you lemons, don’t make lemonade! Make life take the lemons back! Get mad! I don’t want your damn lemons! What am I supposed to do with these? Demand to see life’s manager! Make life rue the day it thought it could give Cave Johnson lemons! Do you know who I am? I’m the man whose gonna burn your house down – with the lemons! I'm gonna get my engineers to invent a combustible lemon that burns your house down!