The Ketchup Hotness Test, and a Moral Dilemma

[BlueCross]

Gonna combine two separate (but related) thoughts in one thread here.

Those of you who have followed my Philosophy of Life Dissertations know full well the validity of the Ketchup Hotness Test.  You know, when you go through a drive through and ask for packet or two of ketchup (cuz the bastards are too cheap to give it away without asking for it anymore).  You can thus grade the 'Hotness Attraction' between you and the window person by simply adding how many packets you get.  Anything over four is a definite Good Thing, and once the numbers start exceeding seven or eight, it might time to start dropping phone numbers.

Anyway, this test in the last few years has pretty left me morose and desolate, as the creeping years slowly grind my once robust and Zeus-like body down to a form more resembling Woody Allen.  Disappointing is not even close to the right word to describe this.  However, about a week ago, I received eight (yes, eight!) packets of ketchup for my very small order.  Well, that certainly pumped me up, and I was feeling quite good about myself.  Oh sure, I have other current relationships, and it seems unlikely I will stray for the love of a minimum wage burger slinger but still, the gesture was nice.  Too bad he wasn't really that good looking.

On a related note, I was subject to quite the ethical question this morning.  Because of 'circumstances' I was unable to grab a bite of breakfast at home, so used the opportunity to grab a McDonald's Breakfast Burrito (hey, we can discuss the health issues in a different thread!) for a mere $1.10.  Plus, free coffee until Nov 20!  It seemed like a very quick way to get my tummy pains alleviated until lunch time rolled around.  Well, after paying my buck and ten cents at the first window, I pulled up to the 'reception' window and the guy handed me my bag but no coffee.  I asked if I could get some taco sauce as well as the free coffee (which I had ordered).  The guy gave me a funny look (at this point I probably should have inspected the bag) and then ran off and returned with my coffee.  "Taco Sauce?" I queried.  He blinked, and turned to grab a couple (N.B. only two!) and handed them to me.  I drove off speculating about the correlation between handing out fries and low I.Q.s

So... I'm driving down the road, I reach into my little bag, and pull out...

Hash browns!

wtf?

I check again, and there is an Egg McMuffin as well.

But no burrito.

Light slowly dawns; I got handed the wrong order.  But now I have opened the bag, and opened the packaging containing the food.  It didn't belong to me but there was no way they would hand it off to the person who ordered it.  They would have to remake the order (and probably already had by now).  But ethically, I feel I should have gone back and got it corrected.  But the Little Devil on my shoulder says "Hey!  You got an Egg McMuffin, fries, and coffee for $1.10!  Stop bitching!".   That logic seemed unassailable so I continued my drive down the road, munching my hash browns and nibbling on the Egg McMuffin (which I really don't like, as it turns out).  But the guilt of my selfish actions still weigh heavily.  So what purpose would it have served to return, when they would have probably had to make another burrito (who knows where the first one ended up---wait, don't answer that!), and caused general chaos in a franchise that is already struggling to stay above the Confusion Water Level.

So what say you, Dear Reader?  Was my decision ethically correct?  Should I have returned the (non-usable) Egg McMuffin?  Would have returning been actually only self-serving to my own ego?  These and other ponderous questions will probably haunt me for days.

Well... at least until lunch.

[Solwyn]

Man those places always screw up my order, but they usually give me something I don't want.

I ordered a bacon egg and cheese bagel and they gave me a steak and onion bagel.

Really? You serve that? Also, for breakfast? Hope your relatives enjoy stankbreath on top of morning breath.

Anyway, I think you're fine ethically. I always run into that problem. Here's another fine example:

I ordered food from Chili's as takeout. I come in and they haven't made my order, in spite of the fact they said it'd be done 10 minutes before. So, I sit down patiently and chat up the random hostess standing at the back. She says they've had a hectic night, and I say I understand, no big deal, things are fine. So then, a lady runs out of the back, calls my name, and hands me my order. I've already paid for it at this point, and she hands me two strawberry lemonades I did not order. I've had places do this a lot if you have to wait for a long time for your food. So, I thought to check my bag, and sure enough there was my order on top, the big mouth bites (basically sliders, or mini-burgers). My wife ordered something that was in a big container, so I didn't even check, I just saw it was in the big container, so I figured I was good.

I get home, and it's completely wrong. I check the ticket, and some other guy's name is on there. I sigh, and head back to the place. On the way I get a call, the manager apologizes, asks if there's anything they can do to make it right. I say it's no big deal, it's like a mile from the house, I'm okay, just let me have my food. They've already remade the other guy's order, so I get to keep the extra food. I'm thinkin' this is not a bad day.

Then I arrive, and the recriminations abound. The guy is furious I walked out with his order. The waitress is implying I am an idiot for not checking the ticket when she handed it to me, and walking out the door with two drinks I didn't order. The hostess I was chatting up is giving me a sidelong glance like I'm a complete moron. Just then, the manager walks up and is horrified that I'm going to sue because of the crowd of people who have suddenly turned on me. I just smile and say I was wrong... to trust the waitress when she called my name and handed me my order. She gets flustered and runs to the kitchen, the old guy and his wife calm down when they realize I just drove all the way home and back (again, only a mile, but in rush hour traffic off the highway), and that they were being senselessly aggro.

Then I get home and the wife starts making fun of me for getting the wrong order. "How did you not know?"

Can't win.

Moral of the story: people screw up. Most of the time you just keep moving. Anyone who judges you for it is a dick. Including your wife.

[BlueCross]

Awesome.

But did you get any extra ketchup packets?

[Hoopy Frood]

Legally, BC, you probably have no culpability. It was their screw up not yours. And you didn't intentionally set out to take someone else's food. A reasonable person can be expected to not always check their order.

Ethically, you're fine for the same reasons.

[Xerxes]

Once got an extra burger at Aberystwyth McDonalds, and it turned out that the server was interested, but me being me, and understanding more Latin than I do the female of the species (and I got a U in Latin GCSE), I didn't notice until it was too late. Ah well, there's always beer.

[MrWeasel]

ok gotta add my own recent story to this one...

Went to KFC for my monthly treat. Now the last 2 times I had been through the drive thru they had hosed up my order so i walked inside this time and placed my order (makeing a comment about the last 2 goof ups) well i quickly look in the bag to make sure all is right (seemed so) and drove home. Well sure enough they had screwed up again (coleslaw in place of mash, no extra gravy and only 1/2 the biscuits i ordered) well i called back and asst manager give me a line of crap about he saw me "check" the order and if it wasn't right at that point it was "my" fault. Well a 5m call to the 800# on the box gets me mailed a coupon for a free "combo" type meal next time i visit... I go back again get my meal and HUGE surprise i get to the car check my order and it wasn't even close...
walked back in and asked for the manager, same asst manager comes out and trys to tell me again the mistake is mine. well lost my top a bit then and got out my cell phone and started dialing the number on the box right there at the counter (i would not be moved) Well at this point the general manager walks in and sees what's happening and low an behold i walk out with a full 20peice bucket with all the sides. Asst manager is now unemployed btw. I could almost feel bad for the hoser. on a final note my order has not been messed up even once since they fired the prick.

[Thanatos]

I have more to contribute, but right now my head hurts and for some reason I'm not thinking very clearly.  However, I can manage to toss this out there; guys, the fast-food-condiment-test you are proposing is the free-drinks-from-female-bartenders test.  You're just adjusting it a bit since you've managed to land a real relationship so you can't nail bartenders any more.  It's a pretty standard thing.

As to whether or not you should have gone back because you got the wrong order, Blue, I feel like you're just being histrionic, and you know it.  That frigging egg mcmuffin or whatever cost McDonalds 27 cents.  They don't give a shit.  More than they don't give a shit, you going back to correct the error will A: cost them the price of your proper order, B: cost them the labor value of the employees who assist you, C: not matter even a little because A and B will sum up to a dollar thirteen.  And the money they already spent on your order is gone.  It's not coming back.  Let me ask you a question.  Say I stole something from you and destroyed it.  Would you be grateful if I came back, told you I robbed you and destroyed your property, cheerfully reported that I had no intention of paying you back for the destroyed property, and then asked for more stuff? 

Okay, you didn't rob them, they gave you the goods, okay, completely not your fault.  Okay.  Let me rephrase.  I didn't rob you, you just fucked up!  But I still have your stuff!  And you still can't have it back!  Now give me more stuff! 

Literally the only thing you could accomplish by going back is getting the employees who made the error into trouble.  Ask yourself if you are morally obligated to make sure that minimum wage employees are punished for (theoretically) innocent mistakes.

Come on, man.

[BlueCross]

I have more to contribute, but right now my head hurts and for some reason I'm not thinking very clearly.  However, I can manage to toss this out there; guys, the fast-food-condiment-test you are proposing is the free-drinks-from-female-bartenders test.  You're just adjusting it a bit since you've managed to land a real relationship so you can't nail bartenders any more.  It's a pretty standard thing.

As to whether or not you should have gone back because you got the wrong order, Blue, I feel like you're just being histrionic, and you know it.  That frigging egg mcmuffin or whatever cost McDonalds 27 cents.  They don't give a shit.  More than they don't give a shit, you going back to correct the error will A: cost them the price of your proper order, B: cost them the labor value of the employees who assist you, C: not matter even a little because A and B will sum up to a dollar thirteen.  And the money they already spent on your order is gone.  It's not coming back.  Let me ask you a question.  Say I stole something from you and destroyed it.  Would you be grateful if I came back, told you I robbed you and destroyed your property, cheerfully reported that I had no intention of paying you back for the destroyed property, and then asked for more stuff? 

Okay, you didn't rob them, they gave you the goods, okay, completely not your fault.  Okay.  Let me rephrase.  I didn't rob you, you just fucked up!  But I still have your stuff!  And you still can't have it back!  Now give me more stuff! 

Literally the only thing you could accomplish by going back is getting the employees who made the error into trouble.  Ask yourself if you are morally obligated to make sure that minimum wage employees are punished for (theoretically) innocent mistakes.

Come on, man.

I like the word 'histrionic'.

[Thanatos]

I felt good while I was saying it.

[Solwyn]

I felt good while I was saying it.

I missed these sort of interchanges.

Also, BC, I didn't get any ketchup. But when I went back there with a friend once, the hostess wrote her number on the receipt. Which to me is very odd, because the only time we spoke, she said I was super sweet for getting my sick wife her favorite meal: a chili's grilled chicken sandwich with no tomato.

I politely threw the receipt away. In a trash can miles from my house.

After shredding it into a thousand pieces.

[Swash]

So, what does it mean when the big burly manager and his wife both occasionally tell their employees to put free extras on my orders?

Ok, yes, I was a very regular customer (meal break every shift when I was working at the office supplies place next door - it was convenient and cheap enough and comparatively healthy) to the point where they knew what I'd be ordering as soon as they saw me, down to knowing which drink I'd get based on how tired I looked.  So maybe they figured I'd bought enough from them that they could afford to shout me some roast potatos or an upsize.

When I changed jobs I still dropped in occasionally (if I was making service calls and happened to be going past at the right time of day) and still got the occasional freebie.  I once got asked to look at a printer in the back office and scored a whole free meal out of that.

Unfortunately I can't do the ketchup test because I don't like sauce of any type and can't stand wasting food.  Or even "food."

[Solwyn]

So, what does it mean when the big burly manager and his wife both occasionally tell their employees to put free extras on my orders?

It means you found a place that takes care of their customers and you need to go there more often.

Unfortunately I can't do the ketchup test because I don't like sauce of any type and can't stand wasting food.  Or even "food."

Well, if they have like a side dish or some kind of item that they give you X small items, count the items they give you. For example, at a local fried chicken place (Chicken Express) the guy that works there knows me from when we first moved into the neighborhood. His brother went to my alma mater and was having a problem with his computer, so I hooked him up with a local guy that fixed it on the cheap, so we're bros now.  So when I'd order the "five tenders" meal I almost always got at least 7.

Which I'm hoping has more to do with bro-ness than hotness.

[Swash]

The volume of chips in the box could be a decent measure, possibly.  There've been times when I've come away with an inch and a half of air at the top of the box while others I've had chips spilling out of the closing fold.  Unfortunately that's a bit more difficult to gauge because it's not always the order-taker who fills the chips (or any of the order, for that matter)