Author Topic: The Pledge of Allegiance, my problem  (Read 4268 times)

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PsychoPompos

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The Pledge of Allegiance, my problem
« on: September 14, 2009, 10:54:56 PM »
I've been seeing and hearing more and more about this.  To me it's utterly pathetic that the debate is over the phrase "under god."  Besides that this version isn't the original i don't care.  What I do care wholeheartedly about is the brainwashing aspect of it.  The fact that were indoctrinated since childhood to pledge our allegiance to the country day in and day out.  Many states have it as LAW that you must say it.

There are two reasons for posting here today.  The first is that i saw an article about the ACLU's political maneuvering, the second is that this is an ongoing problem with me as i was threatened with suspension last year and this year i have the same teacher (I'm a senior in high school).  I face constant shit with her everyday so i stand up to appease her.  Either way the topic is fresh on my mind.

So what do Y'all think about the topic?  I know there are arguments for the religious aspects and punk bands love being dueschbags about the "christian lie"  but do you have any other reasons for your views?  I'm sincerely interested.
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Swash

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Re: The Pledge of Allegiance, my problem
« Reply #1 on: September 15, 2009, 02:12:46 AM »
Brainwashing is part of being in any culture.  Another word for it would be cultural conditioning.

Basically it's part of the "how to be American" conditioning kit.  If you don't do it you're not American, along with apple pie etc.  No idea whether it's good or bad, I'm just saying it's always been around and everyone does it.  Every country, every clique.  They've all got their little rules and rituals that may have originally been designed as a way to expose outsiders.

Hoopy Frood

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Re: The Pledge of Allegiance, my problem
« Reply #2 on: September 15, 2009, 02:21:04 AM »
Personally, I've never understood why saying the pledge is sacrosanct myself. And this is coming from someone who had to say it every day for a good amount of his first few years of elementary school.

But I've never been much of a ritualistic person to being with, so that probably has something to do with it.
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PsychoPompos

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Re: The Pledge of Allegiance, my problem
« Reply #3 on: September 15, 2009, 02:41:07 AM »
The problem with that though Swash is that it has only been "enforced" as it has been since the McCarthy era when the words under god were added.  The earlier tradition fits the bill of cultural conditioning but in its current form the premise seems to be more aobut indoctrination into the system seperate (at least partially) from the culture.

Haha, and to reference F1,  It reminds me of the Cathedral with the screens flashing "Obey."  The fact were taught to repeat this mantra over and over seems more for the purpose of conditioning loyalty to the power structure than for the culture at large. 
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Celest

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Re: The Pledge of Allegiance, my problem
« Reply #4 on: September 15, 2009, 05:06:10 PM »
I rarely said the pledge and caught alot of flak for it. I too, never saw the reason to repeat it over and over.

Night Owl

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Re: The Pledge of Allegiance, my problem
« Reply #5 on: September 21, 2009, 08:22:16 PM »
Personally, I don't care. Although I do think it's a silly place to make one's stand.

In any society, there are certain expectations... for example, when we drive, we stop at certain signs and lights. We even make this stuff a law. Not saying that the two equate, but it's an example of something we're all just expected to do. I think saying the pledge when called upon in a group setting shows a little respect for society in general. I think not saying such makes you stand out, and not in a good way... Whenever I see someone not saying the pledge, I think "pretentious asshole".

Loveshack

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Re: The Pledge of Allegiance, my problem
« Reply #6 on: November 24, 2009, 08:19:40 AM »
I think that groups who complain about stuff like this aren't truly happy unless they have something to complain about. They sit around wringing their hands, ever-watchful for something they can spin into a reason to be offended. The sort of people who thought the Taco Bell chihuahua was a racist conspiracy worthy of a federal tribunal or that Sesame Street has a liberal agenda.

There's a word for these kinds of people... IDIOTS.

In the case of the ACLU, they've gone on for so long without a legitimate case of someone's civil liberties being violated that they are forced to fabricate complex tapestries out of a few flimsy threads or else face the terrible realization that they have outlived their usefulness.

In short, what was a once a proud, noble organization championing the causes of the downtrodden has become of ridiculous cabal of passive-aggressive twats with too much power, money and influence who think that whining behind a clingfilm-thin veneer of legal mumbo jumbo makes them champions of progress. Worse still, there's no one with a big enough set of balls to give them the collective smack upside the head they so richly deserve and, as a result of which, they would be better people. I would love for some Supreme Court Justice, (preferably an ethnic minority, in order to dispel the otherwise inevitable cries of "RACISM!"), would cut one of those blathering fools off mid-sentence, throw tact out the window, and with the collective backing of the American People; black, white, christian, pagan, gay, straight and what-have-you, tell them to kindly "SHUT THE FUCK UP!"

I feel the same way about these people as I do about scientists who could be working on curing cancer, but try to grow square watermelons. I mean, that's cool and all, but isn't there a better and more pressing way to serve the public good?
« Last Edit: November 24, 2009, 08:34:06 AM by Loveshack »
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Loveshack

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Re: The Pledge of Allegiance, my problem
« Reply #7 on: November 24, 2009, 08:31:47 AM »
What I do care wholeheartedly about is the brainwashing aspect of it.  The fact that were indoctrinated since childhood to pledge our allegiance to the country day in and day out.  Many states have it as LAW that you must say it.

You grew up in it, and you're not "brainwashed".
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Night Owl

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Re: The Pledge of Allegiance, my problem
« Reply #8 on: November 25, 2009, 06:36:43 PM »
I feel the same way about these people as I do about scientists who could be working on curing cancer, but try to grow square watermelons. I mean, that's cool and all, but isn't there a better and more pressing way to serve the public good?

well, sometimes the biggest discoveries were made by accident, in a totally unrelated experiment. I think once you limit science by stating what is useful, you kind of defeat the whole purpose.

I'm not smart enough to get paid to research and experiment on anything. So I won't question those who are.